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What's wrong

  • buckfast_beekeeper
  • 13. Oktober 2012 um 13:07
  • Erledigt
  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 13. Oktober 2012 um 13:07
    • #1

    I have a problem with the amplifier board. One channel have a good signal the other a bad signal.

    This is the normal situation

    Channel A is the good one. Channel B the bad one.

    When I change the UTP cable and switch pin 4 and pin 5 then is this the situation.

    The problem is replaced. The problem isn't the controllerboard.

    When I change antenna a to b and b to a, the problem is always channel B. The rods aren't the problem.

    I have replace the opamps from a to b and b to a. The problem is always channel B.

    I have controlled the soldering from the PCB with a 3X loupe. They are OK. I was one forgotten. :( After that the problem is the same.

    I set the amplifying for both channels 53X. Jumpers 2 and 4 set.

    What's wrong.

    The amplifier from my brother I have made too. There wasn't a problem.

  • robo
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    • 13. Oktober 2012 um 15:05
    • #2

    Has it ever worked? Or is this a completely new amplifier board?

    If the board is new, please take photos from assembly and soldering side and post it here. The rings of the resistors should be easily identifiable on the photos.

    If the board has worked before, please check C17 of the faulty channel. This capacitor broke down after a few weeks on my board.

    cu Robo :)

  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 13. Oktober 2012 um 16:19
    • #3

    This is an board than runs 24 days and has the whole time the same problem. It's due the assembly of the second station that I have see the difference.

    Whit soldering is nothing wrong. It's not my first project. In the past I have solder many projects with 0603 smd and Atmega88P-20AU TQFP 32 package. I have soldered with Kester Sn63/Pb37 eutectic solder 0.5mm.

    The resistors are 100% correct placed. Side A is a mirror of side B. I don't think there is anyone happy with 30Mb high quality photo's.

    Maybe I draw a new PCB with 0603 SMD too compare with the TH PCB.

  • robo
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    • 13. Oktober 2012 um 18:12
    • #4
    Zitat von buckfast_beekeeper

    Whit soldering is nothing wrong. It's not my first project. In the past I have solder many projects with 0603 smd and Atmega88P-20AU TQFP 32 package. I have soldered with Kester Sn63/Pb37 eutectic solder 0.5mm.

    The resistors are 100% correct placed. Side A is a mirror of side B. I don't think there is anyone happy with 30Mb high quality photo's.


    If you're sure that with assembly and soldering everything is ok, then please check C17. This capacitor broke down after a few weeks on my board with the same effect as in your case.

    Please measure the voltages (DC) on pins 2, 3, and 6 at IC2 of the faulty channnel against GND. Then remove all gain jumpers at the faulty channel and measure again. Post the resulting voltages.

    cu Robo :)

  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 15. Oktober 2012 um 18:21
    • #5

    I have tested with 10V18 after D1.

    Pin 2: 4V91
    Pin 3: 5V09
    Pin 6 with gain 53 8V8. I have measure the gain resistance between pin 2 and junction C17/R16..R19. These was 1Ω91. Calculated it must be 1Ω92.
    Pin 6 without gain 5V16. With 1 gain jumper set it is every time 8V8.

    edit 1: I don't have a 22n in my assortment. 47n, 100n, 1n7, 22p, 15p aren't problems.

    edit 2: I have removed C17. C17 is 21n1. Nothing wrong I think.

    edit 3: resistor R15 is 99k2. switching opamps have always the same result.

  • robo
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    • 15. Oktober 2012 um 19:46
    • #6

    A similar behavior as with my amplifier when C17 was faulty.
    Voltage at pin 3 should be half of the supply voltage, this is correct. Voltage at pin 2 should be a little higher than at pin 3. Voltage at pin 6 with gain jumper set is too high. You can compare with the working channel.
    I guess that C17 is faulty as it was on my amplifier.

    2 x 47n in series connection (--||--||--) is 23,5n, this should work for testing purposes.

    Measure the resistance of C17. If you can measure a resistance (in my case a few 100 kΩ), the capacitor is faulty.

    cu Robo :)

  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 15. Oktober 2012 um 20:23
    • #7

    I think the problem is solved

    I have removed C17 and soldered back. ?(?(?(

    Robo many thanks. :thumbup:

    Where a forum is good for.

    edit: There is too much difference between channel A and channel B. I have ordered new22n capacitances by Farnell. Normally tomorrow at home and then replace C17 by a new one.

    edit: I think the problem is definitely solved. I have made a new PCB with most SMD components. Resistors and capacitors in 0603 case. Op-amp in SOT23-5 case. The PCB is 83mm X 69,4mm.


    Click able. Left top side, right bottom side. Bottom side have one little fault with the ground plane. :(

    Built up top side.

    Click able.

    result
    :)

    price PCB 27€ incl shipping for 10 pieces. Delivery time 17 days incl shipping.

    2 Mal editiert, zuletzt von buckfast_beekeeper (19. November 2012 um 20:20)

  • Cinam
    Gast
    • 20. November 2012 um 00:38
    • #8

    Hi buckfast_beekeeper,

    how did you solder the SMD parts?

    Egon

  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 20. November 2012 um 11:12
    • #9

    With hand. A Weller WECP-20 (20-years old) solder station with a tip ET-H 0,8mm. Kester eutectick solder 0.4mm.

    Soldering is possible within 1,5 hour. A little solder on one pad, place the component with a little heating. Solder the other pad(s). And resolder the first pad.

    My solder station stay on 300°C.

    TQFP package is possible to solder with hand if you have enough experience. SMD 0603 is maybe to dificult to start with smd. Maybe 0804 is better.

    PCB from Itead

    Maybe I make the processorboard in smd too. With possibility to place the FTDI USB-TTL controller on the board or taking the breakoutboard from SparkFun.

  • podkasts
    Gast
    • 1. Dezember 2012 um 22:32
    • #10

    Very nice keep good work :)
    i also find SMD solder easily then TH.
    When you have time i would relay appreciate if you could make PCB also for controller ;)

  • buckfast_beekeeper
    Gast
    • 3. Dezember 2012 um 20:58
    • #11

    The PCB has the same dimension. Only a few components at the bottom side. A 10cm * 10cm costs by itead the same as an 9cm * 6cm. Why making it smaller? It has a few extra possibility's.

    Bottom side (click-able):

    Only a few C, R, one D and crystal. C and R 0603.

    Top side (click-able):

    What is different?
    A IDC connector with latches (PL1). (Farnell 1106757) The connection is safer then a connector without latches. On the same place it is possible to place a connector like Farnell 2112438.
    Switches to set baudrate GPS and baudrate communication.
    Using a TSR1-2450 switching regulator (Farnell 1696320) in place of a 7805. The efficiency of the TSR-1 is much better than the 7805. The pinning is equal. The 7805 is possible.
    Using 0603 LED for display. It is possible to switch of the PCB led. Al the led are 2mA types.
    Placing an optional Molex connector (Farnell 9732560) to bring the reset, test and led to the outside. The Molex connector needs a not so cheap hand tool. It is also possible to use a normal 0.1" header. On this way it is easy to place the PCB in a box and to remove the cover. It isn't need to solder wire on the normal places.
    Using a normal 10-way ISP connector (Farnell 1106832) or the ISP that I always use. That is a configured TAG connect. It takes not a lot of place on a smd PCB.
    Possibility to work with a USB-TTL cable like I do (Farnell 2143329), SparkFun break out board or solder a FTDI232RL chip. If you will use the FTDI chip, there is the possibility to choose USB power for the chip or powered by the board. In that case the chip must be programmed.

    The PCB isn't in production. Maybe in a few weeks.

    edit: I have reworked the PCB. At the moment it is possible to place the adafruit V3 GPS. It is possible that I send tomorrow the files to Itead for making 10 pieces of the PCB.

    top side click-able:

    bottom side click-able:

    PCB


    Top side click-able


    Bottom side click-able

    Greatings

    Theo

    2 Mal editiert, zuletzt von buckfast_beekeeper (19. Januar 2013 um 18:06) aus folgendem Grund: photo PCB added.

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